Thomas James expresses a fear about government lunar bases, and NASA, that I share. We've got to break out of Apollo mode. I hope that the new administrator understands this, but so far, I see little sign of it.

Of course, few really care if the Antarctic program has its dysfunctional aspects, since it's so relatively inexpensive (and good science does get done, for example in Ozone monitoring, meteorite collection, and millimeter wave astronomy.)

This points again to the need to reduce the cost of getting into and operating in space.

The part that I found troubling was where he mentions the nonexistent technology to cost-effectively extract minerals or hydrocarbons from Antarctica. After all this time, why isn't this possible? And how could we possibly do this on the moon if we can't do it in Antartica?

I don't know what this means, but even if true, it's not very relevant to lunar operations. A technology that's not cost effective in Antarctica at a certain cost-per-ton level might be on the Moon, because of the much higher costs of transportation to get there.

You mean, there are no cost effective technologies to obtain water or oxygen from local sources in Antarctica?

Uh huh.

And how could we possibly do this on the moon if we can't do it in Antartica?

Not can't but won't. Exploitation of that continent is forbade by treaty.

"We've got to break out of Apollo mode"

We did. It's called Shuttle mode.

A government Mars-base? Well then, okay!

A government Mars-base? Well then, okay!

Antarctic bases sound like the beamjacks and moondogs in Allen Steels's "Orbital Decay" and Lunar Descent".

The government "visionaries" recognize this is the direction NASA's heading -- and regard it as a good thing. At last year's Space Frontier Conference, Dr. Pascal Lee said humans would never have permanent settlements on the Moon but pointed to Antarctica as a viable, even desireable model. It's all about enabling a few scientists (very few) to do a few expensive experiments (very few, very expensive).

"We've got to break out of Apollo mode. / We did. It's called Shuttle mode."

The pdf linked above indicates in $/lb. the Saturn 5 cost 18% of what the shuttle does. It sort of puts the Apollo mode in perspective. Not to mention providing capability we currently don't have.

The problems with the Apollo is that it ended up being flags and footprints with little tangible benefits.

What we need is commerce and the way to kickstart that would be to provide property rights and one-way tickets. I guaranty you'd have a million volunteers bidding on the price of a ticket.

Imagine a poker tournament with a $20k buy in. Everybody at the last table gets a ticket which they can then sell to the highest bidder whoever that might be. Satellite games (which now take on a new meaning!) would allow you to compete for that ticket for just a few hundred dollars.

How much is Mars real estate worth, do you think?

In a few decades you've got hundreds if not thousands of people living on Mars (because you can launch more than one can of people each launch cycle.) People that need to buy earth products and will be able to sell their services (why send a probe when you've already got labor on site?)

I believe it was Jerry Pournelle that wrote the book 'a step farther out.' In it he dispels the argument that money spent on space takes away money spent on Earth. He also points out that space is where all the material riches are. It's only small minded thinking that keeps us stuck on this rock. It doesn't matter if we develop things cheaper on or near the Earth than we can on Mars or beyond. Once we have people living life on Mars or beyond, the economy will shape itself and commercial interests on Earth will figure out the need to spend more money on space related activities.

The first step is getting a colony out there... and the means are of relatively little importance. With the riches waiting for us, I say we don't pick one over the other, but use all means we have or can imagine... hmmm... looks like the http://www.davinciproject.com/ had a similar idea, eh?