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The Devil And The Deep Blue Sea

Glenn points to a couple links to discussions as to whether our latest war trophy should be tortured to garner requisite information from him, both to gather up members or terrorist cells and, more immediately, to prevent attacks that may be planned and imminent.

I don't have any firm opinions on the subject, at least at this late hour, but I do wonder--once we've squeezed all the information out of him, and he's a dessicated lemon, what then? What punishment should be in store for him?

I'm not into Biblical, or Hammurabian justice myself, but if you're an "eye for an eye" type, it seems to me that an appropriate retribution might be to take him up to the observation floor (86th) of the Empire State Building, and face him south, toward downtown, so he could view the site of his atrocity. Confront him with a flamethrower, and offer him a choice, just as his victims had...

Posted by Rand Simberg at March 04, 2003 08:24 PM
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He may or may not be physically tortured. They are certainly using sleep deprivation and other psychological methods to break him down. How long can you go without taking a whiz?

Not a shred of remorse in me if Mr. Mohamed doesn't sleep, eat or piss for the next 5 or 6 days

After they finish interrogating him, bring him to the good ol' U.S of A., give him a good lawyer, and try to find an impartial jury. Maybe we can get a change of venue to Venus or Pluto.

Posted by Steve at March 4, 2003 08:50 PM

It's unlikely that he's actually being physically tortured, IMHO. Physical torture is wonderful if you're the Spanish Inquisition and just care that your victims confess without any particular regard for veracity, but if you want accurate information out of somebody it's not so hot.

Now, temporal isolation and disorientation, followed by intense, repetitive questioning with positive stimulus for answers...that's a whole different story.

Posted by Jeff Dougherty at March 4, 2003 09:50 PM

I wrote about this yesterday. I am unalterably opposed to the use of physical pain-oriented forms of torture -- what I'd call Torture with a capital T -- but there are all kinds of things involving wholesome and nutritious but bland and awful food, isolation, lack of sleep, and other psychological methods to get information.

Posted by Dean Esmay at March 5, 2003 01:27 AM

Rand --

Love your blog.

Pardon my minor quibble, but I can't resist. The "eye for an eye" thing? That's actually the equivalent of our Constitutional prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment. "Eye for an eye" means let the punishment fit the crime; i.e., you don't take two legs and an arm for an eye. Eye for an eye is NOT a call for revenge.

Now, that's not to say that I disagree with your proposed punishment. Sounds proportional to me!

Posted by Michael M at March 5, 2003 05:51 AM

Whereas I would give him a little push and then hit him with the flame-thrower before he drops out of sight.

But that's just me.

Posted by Kevin McGehee at March 5, 2003 07:26 AM

Very good article on the success of extreme discomfort and sleep deprivation and the limited usefulness of Torture:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/col/story/64508p-60092c.html

I had 3 days of POW training in the U.S. service years ago and the perspectives of "X" in the article above make sense to me.

Posted by Anarchus at March 5, 2003 07:39 AM

Nah, that'll never work.

I think we should have debates for years over this gentleman's civil rights, demonstrations over him being unfairly imprisoned without representation, repeated public accusations of unfair punishment/torture, signs posted on telephone poles demanding his release, UN sanctions against the US for not allowing him to call [UO]sama and friends on a regular basis... eventually followed by his suing the US government for 3 zillion dollars *and winning*.

Posted by Sanitation Engineer #6 at March 5, 2003 09:28 AM

In as much as I don?t believe in the concept of hell and eternal damnation. I have to take the position that hanging is to good for him. Lock him up for life, they?d have to stick him in solitary confinement for his own safety (just because someone?s committed a felony doesn?t mean he doesn?t love his country) and let him spend the next 20 years trying to figure out why we didn?t just fall apart on 9/11 like they thought we would.

Posted by Shawn at March 5, 2003 10:29 AM

Me thinks a combination of Fear Factor
Dining cuisine and 24/7 of Anna Nicole Smith should be enough torture for anyone

Posted by Mr_alleycat at March 9, 2003 06:21 AM


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