30 thoughts on “Liars And Cheaters”

  1. The left already has pre-established and legit parasitical entities such as the Green party et al. If the (non fake) Tea Party movement can bounce enough RINOs into the Democrat column, it wouldn’t take much to move the present crew out of that party and into the irrelevant ones.

    Result: Change we can believe in.

  2. I just saw a column in Illinois Review from the Green Party candidate for Illinois governor trying to convince Illinois conservatives that he was a true conservative. Very laughable. Every conservative sees through that crap and knows who is really behind the Greens.

    Whitney was a one-time editor of the Socialist Party newrag “The People”, and he stated several times his intentions to have government do more for the people. What real conservative ever says that?

    The shills are everywhere and will get more and more prevalent as election time gets closer. The dhimmicraps are desperate to keep thier power and know they are going to lose it.

  4. This should be really big news but for some reason the Democrats impersonating a different political party in order to commit voter fraud and disenfranchisement barely raises an eyebrow with the MSM.

  6. [[[Michigan Tea Party has some Democratic ties]]]

    Isn’t the Tea Party movement suppose to be non-partisan? If so you would expect to find some Democrats in them. They key I think is not their past, but if the accept the Tea Part doctrine…

  7. Nice try Thomas, one of those principles is not to form a third party. They run candidates against the GOP in primaries.

    These guys are so stupid to think they can fool anyone.

  10. Ken,

    Some examples…

    http://articles.latimes.com/2010/sep/01/nation/la-na-reid-angle-20100902

    [[[The dust-up over her Katrina comment followed news of a 2009 interview in which Angle agreed with a radio host who said some members of Congress might be “domestic enemies,” which the Reid team gleefully paired with her musing this year that “2nd Amendment remedies” might be warranted should Congress not change hands.]]]

    and

    [[[“Angle’s radical views — from her plans to eliminate Social Security and Medicare, to her ‘sink or swim’ message to Katrina victims, to her advocacy of armed revolt against government — these statements aren’t gaffes, they’re long-held positions Sharron Angle believes at her very core,” said Reid spokesman Kelly Steele.]]]

    I generally vote Republican, but thanks to the Tea Party I have no Republican option this year in Nevada, so like many Republicans in Nevada the questions is to not vote for Senator or vote for the option that is least damaging to the state.

    I could go for a major reform of Social Security, but I don’t think anyone who feels bullets are better then ballots has any place in government. Or the government shouldn’t help disaster victims.

    As a side note, she used to teach at the college I am now working at (although she has the name incorrect on her bio…) and from what I have heard from the “old-timers’ about working with her just reinforces my view that the Tea Party, via its naivety, has picked a real loser and given this Senate election to Harry Reid as a gift…

  11. Most office holders take an oath to defend the constitution from domestic enemies. Would mean our founders were nutcases?

    Social security and medicare are programs that didn’t exist at our founding. Is eliminating or replacing government programs an example of being a nutcase?

    ‘Sink or swim’ otherwise known as self responsibility used to be an American value. American values now make you a nutcase?

    Is she really advocating armed revolt or just recognizing that the second amendment is not about rabbit hunting. So supporting our constitution makes you a nutcase?

    Tradition American values now get you labeled a nutcase or it’s to the reeducation camps for ya.

  12. Ken,

    The Founding Fathers also owned slaves and only considered male property owners as being qualified to vote. I guess by your reasoning both are American values as well….

    [[[Is she really advocating armed revolt or just recognizing that the second amendment is not about rabbit hunting.]]]

    http://www.newsweek.com/2010/06/16/sharron-angle-joins-calls-for-armed-revolution-in-america.html

    Sharron Angle Joins Calls for Armed Revolution in America

    If not it sure sounds like it…

    [[[“I hope that’s not where we’re going, but, you know, if this Congress keeps going the way it is, people are really looking toward those Second Amendment remedies and saying, My goodness, what can we do to turn this country around? I’ll tell you the first thing we need to do is take Harry Reid out.”]]]

    In short, vote for the Tea Party or else 🙂

    But Sharron Angles biggest problems, and the ones make her seem like a nut case and costing her the most votes is her actions. One example everyone in Nevada is talking about is her 3 minute press conference…

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/22/sharron-angle-runs-from-r_n_655515.html

    Sharron Angle Runs From Reporters At Her Own Press Conference

    [[[When local reporters attempted to ask Angle questions, the GOP hopeful all but ignored their presence. At the end of the event she bolted quickly.]]]

    Here she is running for Senator and yet avoids the press like a plague… It makes you wonder how bad her judgment is in other areas. And how she will represent the state in the Senate.

    Also, since the original of this post was about Democratic Tea Party members you really need to wonder about this…

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/16/AR2010061605323.html

    Senate candidate Sharron Angle of Nevada left GOP in Reagan years, records show

    By Associated Press
    Thursday, June 17, 2010

    [[[Senate nominee Sharron Angle of Nevada, a tea party favorite who describes herself as a conservative’s conservative, left the Republican Party at the height of the Reagan revolution and became a Democrat for at least several years, government records show.]]]

    [[[Nevada registration records show that Angle has been a member of three, and possibly four, political parties since the 1970s and that she might have left the GOP for more than a decade. ]]]

    Interesting huh? Maybe Reagan was too liberal for her… But if so why join the Democratic Party?

    But as usual she feels no need to explain herself to the folks she wants to vote for her, and then when she loses will probably claim the election was fixed and she will probably go back to her call to arms…

    Really, Nevada was in the bag for Republicans until this nut case showed up. Now she is giving the state to Senator Reid on a sliver platter…

  13. Ken,

    Hmmm, guess I put in too many reference links so it needs moderating…

    Well, this article sums up the view of many Nevada Republicans on Sharron Angle.

    http://www.csmonitor.com/From-the-news-wires/2010/0616/Sharron-Angle-too-radical-for-Nevada-GOP-strategist

    Sharron Angle too ‘radical’ for Nevada GOP strategist

    [[[Sharron Angle is said to be too radical for a Nevada GOP strategist who has organized a ‘Republicans for Reid’ campaign in support of incumbent Democratic Senator Harry Reid.]]]

    Also I forget to mention this gem…

    [[During four terms in the state Assembly, she agitated leaders of both parties as a vote-no oppositional figure with sometimes unconventional views. She wanted female inmates to enter a drug rehabilitation program devised by Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard, an idea she still defends. ]]]

    As quote in the noted, this is probably the only “Republican” in the state Senator Reid is able to beat. Thank you Tea Party.

  14. You’ve provided a lot to respond to. Since we both agree she is not a perfect candidate and doesn’t handle the media well I’m going to address the other issues.

    The Founding Fathers also owned slaves

    That’s true, but they wrote about liberty and meant it.

    only considered male property owners as being qualified to vote

    Being a republic and not a democracy it made sense to have those with responsibility (not just for themselves but woman and children as well) to vote. It worked pretty well. To equate that with misogyny is a false slander. Some people advocate giving children and non-citizens the right to vote. Call me a nutcase because I’m against that.

    if this Congress keeps going the way it is

    So what she actually said is we try voting now, but there may come a time when we have to take on a government that has removed the power of the vote. This is precisely true (although not something we should scare the children of the media with.) Exactly why we have a second amendment. The people shouldn’t fear their government, the government should have a healthy fear of the people. If voting doesn’t do it there may come a time when the people have to do it by other means. Read the declaration of independence.

    left the Republican Party at the height of the Reagan revolution and became a Democrat for at least several years

    Interesting but not relevant regarding her nutcase status.

    Sharron Angle too ‘radical’ for Nevada GOP strategist

    GOP strategist are often too RINO for me. Both the parties find the tea party too radical. That is no argument they are nuts.

    She wanted female inmates to enter a drug rehabilitation program devised by Scientology founder…

    It’s a drug program. Would it help the inmates? Who cares who founded it. He wrote a decent SF that John Travolta destroyed as a movie… again, so what?

    We agree she’s not good with the media. You have not made the case she’s a nut and Reid has not made the case. Are there better candidates? No doubt, but she got the votes. Perhaps NV knows something we don’t having watched her in office for years.

  15. Ken,

    [[[The Founding Fathers also owned slaves

    That’s true, but they wrote about liberty and meant it.]]]

    Yes, and provided a constitution flexible enough to adopt to changing times even if some folks want to turn the clock back to 1787.

    [[[To equate that with misogyny is a false slander. Some people advocate giving children and non-citizens the right to vote.]]]

    Sources please?

    [[[This is precisely true (although not something we should scare the children of the media with.) Exactly why we have a second amendment. The people shouldn’t fear their government, the government should have a healthy fear of the people.]]]

    Yep, hand guns and rifles against tanks and helicopter gunships… That view of the 2nd Amendment may have made sense in the 1700’s, although it didn’t help the Whiskey Rebellion much in their defense… But its out of date for the 21st Century world, unless of course you want to see the people in the U.S. behave like those in third world countries after each election.

    [[[eft the Republican Party at the height of the Reagan revolution and became a Democrat for at least several years

    Interesting but not relevant regarding her nutcase status.]]]

    But the article Rand posted was about former Democrats claiming to belong to the Tea Party. Sharron Angle is a former Democrat. So why do you feel she is sincere and the former Democrats in Michigan are not?

    [[[It’s a drug program. Would it help the inmates? Who cares who founded it. ]]]

    So you believe its OK for the government to promote Scientology with taxpayer money even if it converts drug addicts into members of the Scientology church? Now I see why Sharron Angle views make sense to you…

    [[[Are there better candidates? No doubt, but she got the votes. ]]]

    Yep, thanks to the Tea Party and Senator Reid attacking her opponent Sue Lowden in the primary. Senator Reid knew who he wanted to run against and the Tea Party delivered for him. Hopefully Senator Reid will remember to thank both the Tea Party and Fox News for his reelection. I wonder if President Obama will also thank the Tea Party for preserving his Congressional majority 🙂

    [[[Perhaps NV knows something we don’t having watched her in office for years.]]]

    Yes, NV does. Why do you think Senator Reid surged ahead in the polls after she won the primary and is now leading in the race? With a margin that is widening? Why do you think the Republican candidates she beat are not out supporting her against Senator Reid? They know her and don’t want their reputations to be tarnished by association with her.

    The same Nevada newspapers that had written Senator Reid off now expect him to win in the fall. And will likely endorse him. Yes, NV does know Sharron Angle and does regard her as a nut case even if she is the darling of the talking heads on Fox News and the Tea Party.

  16. Hi Ken,

    I didn’t want my last reply to be hung up in moderation due to references, so here is another article for you.

    http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/06/reid-opponent-embraces-patriot-group-that-warns-of-giant-concentration-camps.php

    Reid Opponent Embraces Patriot Group That Warns Of ‘Giant Concentration Camps’

    Justin Elliott and Evan McMorris-Santoro | June 9, 2010, 1:03AM

    [[[Back in April, Angle told TPMDC she was a member of the Oath Keepers at a press gaggle in Washington. On Monday, we decided to call Angle’s campaign to confirm her relationship to the group. Angle’s husband, Ted, picked up the phone.

    “We support what the organization stands for,” he told us. “Sharron does.”

    Members of Oath Keepers — whose motto is “Not on our watch!” — subscribe to a 10-item declaration affirming that they will not, for example, force citizens into detention camps or invade a state “that asserts its sovereignty and declares the national government to be in violation of the compact by which that state entered the Union.”]]]

    [[[According to the SPLC, Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes, a former staffer for Rep. Ron Paul (R-TX) warns his followers against “a coming dictatorship” that will happen if “our brothers in arms go along and comply with unconstitutional, unlawful orders.” ]]]

    Sure sounds to me like she has listened to one too many Art Bell conspiracy shows…

  17. Yep, hand guns and rifles against tanks and helicopter gunships… That view of the 2nd Amendment may have made sense in the 1700’s, although it didn’t help the Whiskey Rebellion much in their defense… But its out of date for the 21st Century world, unless of course you want to see the people in the U.S. behave like those in third world countries after each election.

    Mr. Tom: The second ammendment no longer makes sense because… governments have tanks and helicopters now. And.. something about behaving like a third word country.

    Great laugh, thanks.

  18. Curt,

    The radical right idea that it was to enable individual citizens to over throw the government is a laugh today. And not supported by the courts or the Federalist Papers. Why do you think it included the term militia? It only started to emerge with the survivalist movement about a generation ago.

    The main stream, and court interpreted idea, that its for personal defense does make sense and is defensible.

  19. “hand guns and rifles against tanks and helicopter gunships”

    Why do I need to learn how to throw a knife? I can just push a button and nuke them.” – starship troopers.

    Thomas, if it ever comes to it, it won’t be flint knives against 155mm howitzers.

    That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government

    This is a solemn duty as an American. Let’s hope it doesn’t come to that.

    The radical right idea that it was to enable individual citizens to over throw the government is a laugh today.

    It’s called haughtiness and it’s disgusting.

  20. Getting back to point, the only way we’re going to get this government fixed is if we elect enough nutcases because your typical politician is incapable of facing the issues they’ve created.

  21. Ken,

    I see. You actually believe that if the majority of Americans disagree with your interpretation of the Constitution and on which direction America should go, and indicate so by their choices on election day, it’s OK for you to use Your Guns to Force the majority of Americans to accept you Views and to run the Country the way you think is should be run.

    And you honestly believe this is what the Founding Fathers had in mind with the 2nd Amendment? That folks who disagree with the outcome of an election should have the right to use Guns to overturn the results of that Election?

  22. Ken,

    [[[Getting back to point, the only way we’re going to get this government fixed is if we elect enough nutcases because your typical politician is incapable of facing the issues they’ve created.]]]

    The problem is that “nutcases” are rarely elected because most Americans are middle of the road in politics. And when they are their lack of knowledge of the political process and unwillingness to compromise makes them ineffective.

    That is why, although two-thirds of Sharron Angle “supporters” would preferred to vote for someone else they may still vote for her, knowing that she will be as ineffective in pushing her agenda as a Senator as she was in the Nevada legislature.

    The same will be true of most of the Tea Party members that are elected. They will rant and rave on Fox news, but accomplish nothing as the democrats move forward with their agenda. The best hope for stopping the Democrats agenda was to elect mainstream Republicans, but the Tea Party is basically destroying that option this year.

  23. You actually believe that if the majority of Americans disagree

    That’s not what I said. I said, “there may come a time when we have to take on a government that has removed the power of the vote.”

    You have twisted what I said. Don’t do that.

    Some people advocate giving children and non-citizens the right to vote. Sources please?

    For doubting Thomas, who apparently thinks I’m making stuff up…

    The following modified to not be so ‘spammy’…

    onechildonevote[dot]org

    sfgate[dot]com /cgi-bin/blogs/cityinsider/detail

    ?entry_id=63778&tsp=1

    dailyprincetonian.com /2006/10/11/16134/

    allheadlinenews.com /articles/7011553322

  25. Ken,

    [[[Some people advocate giving children and non-citizens the right to vote. Sources please?

    For doubting Thomas, who apparently thinks I’m making stuff up…]]]

    Oh, some blogs and fringe groups… I thought you had some serious news stories on it…

    I guess that is why you worry about the government also takinga way you power to vote.

    As for McCain, he probably would have won if he had picked someone like Mitt Romney instead of Sarah Palin for VP, but a lot of folks looked at his age and her nuttiness and said “no way”…

  26. Right Thomas. You’ve got the lamestream media patter down.

    Oh, some blogs and fringe groups… I thought you had some serious news stories on it…

    There were. I don’t have references to the news I listened to. You can describe anybody as fringe or nuts, but that doesn’t change the fact that it is seriously advocated.

    I guess that is why you worry about the government also taking away your power to vote.

    You’d worry if you realized your vote is in jeopardy as well. For the record, you may still be able to vote (why take away that illusion from the people) but it doesn’t matter if it’s effectively nullified by shenanigans that have been going on as long as voting has. Look at MN. Look at WA. It’s already been done and those are only example we know about. Obama has been accused of doing the same with Hillary. It wouldn’t take much for him to do the same nationwide.

    Or perhaps you think the dead convicts that elected Al Franken were legit?

  27. Ken,

    [[[You can describe anybody as fringe or nuts, but that doesn’t change the fact that it is seriously advocated.]]]

    There are folks who seriously advocate that the government should tell everyone it has been in a partnership with aliens from space since 1947. Just because someone advocates something doesn’t mean they aren’t missing a few cards in the deck:-)

    [[[You’d worry if you realized your vote is in jeopardy as well. For the record, you may still be able to vote (why take away that illusion from the people) but it doesn’t matter if it’s effectively nullified by shenanigans that have been going on as long as voting has. Look at MN. Look at WA. It’s already been done and those are only example we know about. Obama has been accused of doing the same with Hillary. It wouldn’t take much for him to do the same nationwide.]]]

    So fixing votes is something new? Or did you just discover it? I guess you never read how LBJ got elected Senator in 1946. Or Richard Nixon’s skills at it.

    Vote fixing has been going on since the first election by both sides. The key is to work to have better laws and regulations for voting and good folks overseeing, not start a revolution over…

    But tell me. If you are so worried about voting have your ever volunteered to work as a poll worker or election judge? Most communities have problems finding folks to work those positions. I know because I have done both in the past. You only get paid for a few hours of work so it mostly charity. But I did it because I wanted to contribute to making the election process work. If you are so fired up about it, then call your local county election board and volunteer, or you local political party headquarters and ask to be a poll watcher. Just don’t rant about it online and threaten revolution…. Do something productive.

  28. Vote fixing has been going on since the first election by both sides.

    We have complete agreement on this particular point. I’m talking about something more and I would have thought you’d have caught that by now.

    We have already moved a considerable distance down the road of government taking power they aught not to have and people giving up freedom. If we stopped it today it would not be near enough, but the political process might still have a chance of correcting some of the wrong.

    Having come down this road so far, it’s easy to see it go farther. It’s easy to see a day when government (not just those that have the power to get elected regardless of what people want) but judges and other officials rule our lives as well as any dictatorship. For millions of people in this world, living under dictatorship is normal life.

    I don’t see you as a fool, but if you can’t see that, I’d be wrong.

  29. Ken,

    You need to read some history. Every generation in this country seems to think its seeing the end of liberty but it always turns out to be the opposite. Everyone generation seems to think the voting fraud is the worst it has ever been, but actually its probably less now then in the past. You really need to stop looking for the gloom and doom in everything.

  30. I see you’ve completely ignored my noting the creeping loss of liberty by suggesting the water really isn’t getting any hotter… just relax and continue to enjoy that sauna… toss in a few cubes of broth and some veggies.

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