If these stories are true, Russian military morale seems…suboptimal.
43 thoughts on ““Let Someone Whack You””
Thanks for the latest Clown Car, Rand. Another regurgitation of Ukie propaganda. Thats the author’s source, she admits. This are the same MSM that told us the Jab was both safe and effective. Why start believing them now?
Given Russia’s military history, I see no particular reason to disbelieve it.
What is it about the Russians that has suddenly disabled your skeptical processes?
My knowledge of Russian military history? We have satellite images of how disastrous their offensive has been, on almost all fronts.
Do you ever pause to question who wrote those history books and why? History is written by the …… you know the old saying.
Much of the history I’ve read was written by Russians.
It must sting that naked Ukie propaganda is more believable than whatever you’re trying to sell.
It fits with the observations regarding Russian failures in this war: the failure to capture Kyiv, the failure to capture Kharkiv, the recent loss of earlier territorial gains, the loss of the Moskva, the loss of so many senior officers, the huge amounts of military hardware that has been lost, the failure to achieve air supremacy, the reliance on the indiscriminate use of artillery.
For Russia to suffer so many failures low of morale should be expected, like hand and glove these things go together.
Expect the moment to continue to shift in favor of Ukraine, the Russian military is getting smaller and less well equipped while Ukraine’s military is growing and getting better equipment. By making a general mobilization difficult for himself Putin has condemned Russia to fight with one hand tied behind it’s back.
If it’s all just “Ukie propaganda” we’re hearing why isn’t all of Ukraine
occupied by Russian forces almost 3 months into this invasion? Why haven’t ANY Russian military objectives been met?
There is certainly some propaganda being spread here, but it isn’t Rand/Ukraine that’s spreading it….
Never fall for the second classic mistake: Believing propaganda – yours or theirs.
The truth may come out, but not today or tomorrow.
It sure looks as though Putin believed his own.
Looks like his intel and planning forces did, anyway.
And poot-poot believed them.
Sounds like a classic military folktale recycled for the current conflict that is ‘too good to be checked’. I bet there was a similar story told in taverns outside of Caesar’s Legions about how the barbarians were reluctant to fight.
On the propaganda front there are very aggressive swarms of obnoxious pro-Russian and obnoxious pro-Ukrainian internet trolls rattling around the weblogs…
“On the propaganda front there are very aggressive swarms of obnoxious pro-Russian and obnoxious pro-Ukrainian internet trolls rattling around the weblogs…”
Yes. Ukraine’s propaganda machine is simply amazing.
Compared to how astonishingly transparent the pro-Russian trolls are, it’s hard not to look amazing.
That is true but the Ukrainians are also doing a really good job of propaganda in general.
While I don’t find the story implausible, it’s not like anybody should care what I or anybody else at this distance thinks. None of us can know and I don’t have the slightest faith that the media has any intention of reporting anything not furthering their selected narrative. Still, so far, all the gross evidence is that things are going very badly for Russia.
We’ve seen one attack repulsed. If Russia had the resources of men and equipment to prevail, that would have been the time to commit them. They didn’t. Moreover, they seem to have recycled the survivors of that debacle into their new front lines. This is probably having a particularly bad effect on morale.
Since then, they have greatly reduced their scope of operations yet still seem unable to concentrate enough combat power to achieve anything better than a stalemate anywhere. This is, again, an indication that they don’t have much depth.
The Russians may yet outlast the Ukrainians, only time will tell. The real unknown is whether this protracted and very expensive failure might cause some sort of change in the Kremlin. Russians seem to have an almost infinite tolerance for disastrous rulers so anybody banking on Putin being replaced by someone more grounded in reality will probably be disappointed.
Telenko’s analysis of Starlink is interesting. Apparently, Russia hasn’t been able to jam Starlink. And Starlink combined with an Uber-style software apparently results in on demand artillery strikes within 30 seconds from dispersed artillery that can immediately relocate.
When all is said and done, Starlink may end being the most cyber secure system out there. Russia has tried to interfere with Starlink, and SpaceX keeps adapting in a manner that an Air Force general describes as “eyewatering”.
The ASAT attacks against Starlink show that Russia views our space based assets as targets. At some point, the cost benefit analysis for them could lead to decisions we don’t like.
Are we ready to go? Cause it feels like we are dry humping and no one has a condom but things still gonna happen anyway.
Amazing what can be accomplished when you have a solid profit motive behind it. And not layers and layers of unqualified bureaucrats in the way.
Still, so far, all the gross evidence is that things are going very badly for Russia.
And after all, it’s not like gross Russian military ineptitude does not have a long and spectacular pedigree, even right through much of the Soviet era, with certain explanatory patterns repeating themselves.
It’s not reasonable to take most of the reportage of western (let alone Ukrainian) media coverage at face value, but it’s also not unreasonable to think that, indeed, the Russians have had some significant setbacks due to miscalculations and ineptitude.
Looks impossible, for both sides. Glad I am not there! So, people don’t like getting shot at? No kidding. Supplies are short and upper levels of command are incompetent? Wow. First time you read about combat from those who are in it?
“Wow. First time you read about combat from those who are in it?”
Pretty much. Ukraine has the advantage of access to Russian communications. They can pick and choose what to release and they can fabricate whatever they need to to make the story more sensational.
Russia’s propaganda tries to do the same, video from dead soldiers, Nazi paraphernalia, and coerced statements from captives.
Ukraine has the advantage of feeling more authentic but you cant really believe anything they say even if it is part true.
Uber for artillery strikes. Wonder if they’ve patented it? The “killer” app would be to combine it with a way to trace robocalls.
My biggest takeaway was that Yahoo News is now comfortable using Daily Beast articles that employ “batshit” in top level news text.
From Larry Johnson’s blog.
“If Russia was losing or completely stuck in Ukraine, one would expect that Sergei Shoigu would be the guy calling Austin and begging for mercy. Well, that is not what happened. It was Austin that placed the call, apparently unconcerned about his recent public call to weaken Russia. Why would Austin urge Shoigu to implement an “immediate ceasefire” if Russia was getting its ass kicked? Russia getting whipped by Ukraine is exactly what Austin has called for. Remember?”
“Why would Austin urge Shoigu to implement an “immediate ceasefire””
Probably because they want a negotiated end to the war and not protracted urban combat. I suspect that our leaders are telling Russia we will let them keep everything if they just stop the war but Russia knows that will be on the table right up until they get pushed out of Ukraine, so wont be taking the offer now.
If the Brandon Administration had brains they’d incentivize the deal. End the war now and somehow thermobaric weapons won’t end up in Ukrainian hands. Otherwise accidents will happen. It’d be a shame if something happened to Belgorod. Such a nice city ya have there.
I don’t know what Brandon is up to and Russia and Ukraine get a say, but everyone sending guns, money, and men should also be looking for a way out of this.
Austin called Shoigu because Ukrainians are winning and the Pentagon has never dealt with a clear victory against a significant enemy since 1945. They don’t have any procedures for it. It’s just unthinkable. So they’re searching for some way to achieve defeat despite overwhelming odds.
Please no.
If Russia was losing or completely stuck in Ukraine, one would expect that Sergei Shoigu would be the guy calling Austin and begging for mercy. Well, that is not what happened.
How would this Larry character know what happened?
The individual story is likely true but that doesn’t mean it is representative.
Something I have noticed is that both sides use pictures of dead bodies and captives to show how well they are doing and when people talk about the war, they often point to the losses sustained because they look at those pictures.
It is pretty easy to look at nothing but dead Russians and assume they are getting their butts kicked but it is also easy to look at dead Ukrainians and come to the same conclusion. If that is all you see and you don’t see any differing information, it is easy to see why pro-Ukrainian and pro-Russian people think the way they do.
The problem for us is that we only get Ukrainian propaganda and not any sort of impartial news. We have to sort through BS we shouldn’t have to because our media are corrupt and incompetent.
For me, the preponderance of evidence shows Russia isn’t doing well but I know the limitations of the information I get and that Russians aren’t the only ones dying.
It is rather amazing though, how all the things we debate on the subject of the USA and war go right out the window when people participate in the illusion that we are not at war now. Libertarian, Republican, Democrat, Independent, or whatever. This is like the what, fourth society wide mass social illusion contagion in the last 3 years?
We can read maps, though, and if Russia isn’t doing badly, they’re doing an excellent job of faking it. Considering that during the Stalingrad campaign, the Soviets executed over 19,000 of their own men for cowardice pour encouragers les autres, I find it very easy to believe that an army that hasn’t seen significant combat since Chechnya is doing poorly and has obviously seriously scaled back their goals, and yet still can’t concentrate enough force at critical points to make clean breakthroughs, let alone take advantage of one. Considering how completely overmatched the Chechens were, the Russian performance in both wars was seriously sub-par. I see absolutely no evidence that they’ve improved since then.
“We can read maps, though, and if Russia isn’t doing badly, they’re doing an excellent job of faking it.”
My point was that regardless of how Russia is doing, we are getting a one sided view, an incomplete picture, and its important to sort through the sensational BS.
Glad to see everyone has caught the fever.
We have commercial reconnaissance satellite pictures, we know where Russian forces are as opposed to where they would like to be. We can count the hulks of destroyed tanks, IFVs etc.
The vaunted Russian juggernaut is failing miserably.
Who is “we”?
I don’t think you are reply to anything I actually said. Do you think I’m pumping up Russia’s performance somehow? Because that certainly isn’t something I have done.
Hey, if you are independently sourcing satellite imagery to check your sources, great. But I’m guessing you are relying on other people giving you information and that you then trust them to one degree or another.
My comments have all advocated people be skeptical and sober about all of this and the reason I take that approach is because too many people aren’t thinking rationally and getting caught up in hysterias.
All the people yelling about how big a deal it is that Russia invaded Ukraine again don’t take this nearly as serious as they should, IMO.
@wodun (can’t reply directly)
So the commercial sat photos might be fake? And the commercial sat companies are being quite about it when someone doctors one of their photos and makes false claims about it? And Ukraine hasn’t really retaken any territory, sunk the Russian Black Sea flagship, bombed Snake island numerous times, destroy hundreds of Russian vehicles/aircraft and Russia is actually still at the gates of Kiev…
Seems there is more “hysteria” involved in believing all of THAT than it does to believe that things are pretty much, give or take, as they seem: Russia is failing miserably at achieving anything close to its military goals in Ukraine.
“So the commercial sat photos might be fake?’
Dude, c’mon. At least respond to things I have said rather than stuff words in my mouth.
You aren’t doing original research but relying on others. That is fine. We all do it. We also have to be aware of the limitations of the information we take in. This isn’t controversial.
When you say, “we”, you speak as an aspirational member of a team and not specific people. Yes, “we” as a country have access to all kinds of information. That doesn’t mean “we” and in you and me have that information.
“Seems there is more “hysteria” involved in believing all of THAT ”
Who believes that and how is it relevant to what I was saying? I’d give the same advice on Russia propaganda.
But notice here we are talking about this on a thread where Ukraine put POWs in front of a camera to say bad things about the Russian military? And notice how Russia puts Ukrainian POWs on video to say bad things about Ukraine?
As Americans, we are pretty skeptical of Russia doing this because we have seen these videos countless times. But when we do it to ourselves, we eat it up regardless of the veracity of the propaganda.
My mistake. This was an intercepted audio recording. The parading of POWs was a different event.
“Let Someone Whack You”
The old Hogan’s Heros gag switches to the Western Front from the Eastern Front. The Ukraine War fought Chicago-style.
Thanks for the latest Clown Car, Rand. Another regurgitation of Ukie propaganda. Thats the author’s source, she admits. This are the same MSM that told us the Jab was both safe and effective. Why start believing them now?
Given Russia’s military history, I see no particular reason to disbelieve it.
What is it about the Russians that has suddenly disabled your skeptical processes?
My knowledge of Russian military history? We have satellite images of how disastrous their offensive has been, on almost all fronts.
Do you ever pause to question who wrote those history books and why? History is written by the …… you know the old saying.
Much of the history I’ve read was written by Russians.
It must sting that naked Ukie propaganda is more believable than whatever you’re trying to sell.
It fits with the observations regarding Russian failures in this war: the failure to capture Kyiv, the failure to capture Kharkiv, the recent loss of earlier territorial gains, the loss of the Moskva, the loss of so many senior officers, the huge amounts of military hardware that has been lost, the failure to achieve air supremacy, the reliance on the indiscriminate use of artillery.
For Russia to suffer so many failures low of morale should be expected, like hand and glove these things go together.
Expect the moment to continue to shift in favor of Ukraine, the Russian military is getting smaller and less well equipped while Ukraine’s military is growing and getting better equipment. By making a general mobilization difficult for himself Putin has condemned Russia to fight with one hand tied behind it’s back.
If it’s all just “Ukie propaganda” we’re hearing why isn’t all of Ukraine
occupied by Russian forces almost 3 months into this invasion? Why haven’t ANY Russian military objectives been met?
There is certainly some propaganda being spread here, but it isn’t Rand/Ukraine that’s spreading it….
Never fall for the second classic mistake: Believing propaganda – yours or theirs.
The truth may come out, but not today or tomorrow.
It sure looks as though Putin believed his own.
Looks like his intel and planning forces did, anyway.
And poot-poot believed them.
Sounds like a classic military folktale recycled for the current conflict that is ‘too good to be checked’. I bet there was a similar story told in taverns outside of Caesar’s Legions about how the barbarians were reluctant to fight.
On the propaganda front there are very aggressive swarms of obnoxious pro-Russian and obnoxious pro-Ukrainian internet trolls rattling around the weblogs…
“On the propaganda front there are very aggressive swarms of obnoxious pro-Russian and obnoxious pro-Ukrainian internet trolls rattling around the weblogs…”
Yes. Ukraine’s propaganda machine is simply amazing.
Compared to how astonishingly transparent the pro-Russian trolls are, it’s hard not to look amazing.
That is true but the Ukrainians are also doing a really good job of propaganda in general.
While I don’t find the story implausible, it’s not like anybody should care what I or anybody else at this distance thinks. None of us can know and I don’t have the slightest faith that the media has any intention of reporting anything not furthering their selected narrative. Still, so far, all the gross evidence is that things are going very badly for Russia.
We’ve seen one attack repulsed. If Russia had the resources of men and equipment to prevail, that would have been the time to commit them. They didn’t. Moreover, they seem to have recycled the survivors of that debacle into their new front lines. This is probably having a particularly bad effect on morale.
Since then, they have greatly reduced their scope of operations yet still seem unable to concentrate enough combat power to achieve anything better than a stalemate anywhere. This is, again, an indication that they don’t have much depth.
More informed analysis is here:
https://threadreaderapp.com/user/TrentTelenko
The Russians may yet outlast the Ukrainians, only time will tell. The real unknown is whether this protracted and very expensive failure might cause some sort of change in the Kremlin. Russians seem to have an almost infinite tolerance for disastrous rulers so anybody banking on Putin being replaced by someone more grounded in reality will probably be disappointed.
Telenko’s analysis of Starlink is interesting. Apparently, Russia hasn’t been able to jam Starlink. And Starlink combined with an Uber-style software apparently results in on demand artillery strikes within 30 seconds from dispersed artillery that can immediately relocate.
When all is said and done, Starlink may end being the most cyber secure system out there. Russia has tried to interfere with Starlink, and SpaceX keeps adapting in a manner that an Air Force general describes as “eyewatering”.
The ASAT attacks against Starlink show that Russia views our space based assets as targets. At some point, the cost benefit analysis for them could lead to decisions we don’t like.
Are we ready to go? Cause it feels like we are dry humping and no one has a condom but things still gonna happen anyway.
Amazing what can be accomplished when you have a solid profit motive behind it. And not layers and layers of unqualified bureaucrats in the way.
Still, so far, all the gross evidence is that things are going very badly for Russia.
And after all, it’s not like gross Russian military ineptitude does not have a long and spectacular pedigree, even right through much of the Soviet era, with certain explanatory patterns repeating themselves.
It’s not reasonable to take most of the reportage of western (let alone Ukrainian) media coverage at face value, but it’s also not unreasonable to think that, indeed, the Russians have had some significant setbacks due to miscalculations and ineptitude.
Looks impossible, for both sides. Glad I am not there! So, people don’t like getting shot at? No kidding. Supplies are short and upper levels of command are incompetent? Wow. First time you read about combat from those who are in it?
“Wow. First time you read about combat from those who are in it?”
Pretty much. Ukraine has the advantage of access to Russian communications. They can pick and choose what to release and they can fabricate whatever they need to to make the story more sensational.
Russia’s propaganda tries to do the same, video from dead soldiers, Nazi paraphernalia, and coerced statements from captives.
Ukraine has the advantage of feeling more authentic but you cant really believe anything they say even if it is part true.
Uber for artillery strikes. Wonder if they’ve patented it? The “killer” app would be to combine it with a way to trace robocalls.
My biggest takeaway was that Yahoo News is now comfortable using Daily Beast articles that employ “batshit” in top level news text.
From Larry Johnson’s blog.
“If Russia was losing or completely stuck in Ukraine, one would expect that Sergei Shoigu would be the guy calling Austin and begging for mercy. Well, that is not what happened. It was Austin that placed the call, apparently unconcerned about his recent public call to weaken Russia. Why would Austin urge Shoigu to implement an “immediate ceasefire” if Russia was getting its ass kicked? Russia getting whipped by Ukraine is exactly what Austin has called for. Remember?”
“Why would Austin urge Shoigu to implement an “immediate ceasefire””
Probably because they want a negotiated end to the war and not protracted urban combat. I suspect that our leaders are telling Russia we will let them keep everything if they just stop the war but Russia knows that will be on the table right up until they get pushed out of Ukraine, so wont be taking the offer now.
If the Brandon Administration had brains they’d incentivize the deal. End the war now and somehow thermobaric weapons won’t end up in Ukrainian hands. Otherwise accidents will happen. It’d be a shame if something happened to Belgorod. Such a nice city ya have there.
I don’t know what Brandon is up to and Russia and Ukraine get a say, but everyone sending guns, money, and men should also be looking for a way out of this.
Austin called Shoigu because Ukrainians are winning and the Pentagon has never dealt with a clear victory against a significant enemy since 1945. They don’t have any procedures for it. It’s just unthinkable. So they’re searching for some way to achieve defeat despite overwhelming odds.
Please no.
If Russia was losing or completely stuck in Ukraine, one would expect that Sergei Shoigu would be the guy calling Austin and begging for mercy. Well, that is not what happened.
How would this Larry character know what happened?
The individual story is likely true but that doesn’t mean it is representative.
Something I have noticed is that both sides use pictures of dead bodies and captives to show how well they are doing and when people talk about the war, they often point to the losses sustained because they look at those pictures.
It is pretty easy to look at nothing but dead Russians and assume they are getting their butts kicked but it is also easy to look at dead Ukrainians and come to the same conclusion. If that is all you see and you don’t see any differing information, it is easy to see why pro-Ukrainian and pro-Russian people think the way they do.
The problem for us is that we only get Ukrainian propaganda and not any sort of impartial news. We have to sort through BS we shouldn’t have to because our media are corrupt and incompetent.
For me, the preponderance of evidence shows Russia isn’t doing well but I know the limitations of the information I get and that Russians aren’t the only ones dying.
It is rather amazing though, how all the things we debate on the subject of the USA and war go right out the window when people participate in the illusion that we are not at war now. Libertarian, Republican, Democrat, Independent, or whatever. This is like the what, fourth society wide mass social illusion contagion in the last 3 years?
We can read maps, though, and if Russia isn’t doing badly, they’re doing an excellent job of faking it. Considering that during the Stalingrad campaign, the Soviets executed over 19,000 of their own men for cowardice pour encouragers les autres, I find it very easy to believe that an army that hasn’t seen significant combat since Chechnya is doing poorly and has obviously seriously scaled back their goals, and yet still can’t concentrate enough force at critical points to make clean breakthroughs, let alone take advantage of one. Considering how completely overmatched the Chechens were, the Russian performance in both wars was seriously sub-par. I see absolutely no evidence that they’ve improved since then.
“We can read maps, though, and if Russia isn’t doing badly, they’re doing an excellent job of faking it.”
My point was that regardless of how Russia is doing, we are getting a one sided view, an incomplete picture, and its important to sort through the sensational BS.
Glad to see everyone has caught the fever.
We have commercial reconnaissance satellite pictures, we know where Russian forces are as opposed to where they would like to be. We can count the hulks of destroyed tanks, IFVs etc.
The vaunted Russian juggernaut is failing miserably.
Who is “we”?
I don’t think you are reply to anything I actually said. Do you think I’m pumping up Russia’s performance somehow? Because that certainly isn’t something I have done.
Hey, if you are independently sourcing satellite imagery to check your sources, great. But I’m guessing you are relying on other people giving you information and that you then trust them to one degree or another.
My comments have all advocated people be skeptical and sober about all of this and the reason I take that approach is because too many people aren’t thinking rationally and getting caught up in hysterias.
All the people yelling about how big a deal it is that Russia invaded Ukraine again don’t take this nearly as serious as they should, IMO.
@wodun (can’t reply directly)
So the commercial sat photos might be fake? And the commercial sat companies are being quite about it when someone doctors one of their photos and makes false claims about it? And Ukraine hasn’t really retaken any territory, sunk the Russian Black Sea flagship, bombed Snake island numerous times, destroy hundreds of Russian vehicles/aircraft and Russia is actually still at the gates of Kiev…
Seems there is more “hysteria” involved in believing all of THAT than it does to believe that things are pretty much, give or take, as they seem: Russia is failing miserably at achieving anything close to its military goals in Ukraine.
“So the commercial sat photos might be fake?’
Dude, c’mon. At least respond to things I have said rather than stuff words in my mouth.
You aren’t doing original research but relying on others. That is fine. We all do it. We also have to be aware of the limitations of the information we take in. This isn’t controversial.
When you say, “we”, you speak as an aspirational member of a team and not specific people. Yes, “we” as a country have access to all kinds of information. That doesn’t mean “we” and in you and me have that information.
“Seems there is more “hysteria” involved in believing all of THAT ”
Who believes that and how is it relevant to what I was saying? I’d give the same advice on Russia propaganda.
But notice here we are talking about this on a thread where Ukraine put POWs in front of a camera to say bad things about the Russian military? And notice how Russia puts Ukrainian POWs on video to say bad things about Ukraine?
As Americans, we are pretty skeptical of Russia doing this because we have seen these videos countless times. But when we do it to ourselves, we eat it up regardless of the veracity of the propaganda.
My mistake. This was an intercepted audio recording. The parading of POWs was a different event.
“Let Someone Whack You”
The old Hogan’s Heros gag switches to the Western Front from the Eastern Front. The Ukraine War fought Chicago-style.
Putin: “Shoigu!”
Shoigu: “I know nothing!”