This is pretty funny, particularly in light of recent flag-related events: “In a twist to recent controversies, Southern States’ militias arming quickly to defend Federal (Union) troops.”
The level of stupidity from the elites in this conversation has been more staggering than usual. First, General Ordierno issued this idiocy:
“I think we have to be careful about over-arming ourselves, and I’m not talking about where you end up attacking each other,” Gen. Ray Odierno, chief of staff of the Army, told reporters. Instead, he said, it’s more about “accidental discharges and everything else that goes along with having weapons that are loaded that causes injuries.”
No one is proposing that anyone “over-arm” service people. And the notion that this has anything to do with Posse Comitatus is ridiculous. They aren’t going to be carrying automatic weapons.
Then we had Martha Radatz, who asked something like “what does that look like”?
Here’s the reality. In the many states that are shall-issue (and the number is growing), a properly soldier can go out and get a CCW, and carry anywhere it’s forbidden. Few non-idiots think that this actually presents a threat to the populace. But when he enters his place of employment, (s)he has to surrender the weapon that (s)he can carry everywhere else, giving up the Second-Amendment natural right of self defense. As a result, a few dozen military personnel have been killed on base over the past few years, mostly by Islamic nutjobs who (unaccountably!) ignored the no-gun policy on base. (including one that was an Army major). The death toll in each and every one of these cases would have been eliminated or dramatically reduced had those present trained and allowed by the civilian government to carry been allowed to carry on base.
The issue of recruiting stations is a different problem because it’s a result not of outdated military policies, but of the “gun-free” mentality of shopping malls. In this case, I think the solution is a few lawsuits by the families of those murdered by people who (unexpectedly!) didn’t pay attention to the sign or policy.
[Update a few minutes later]
More links from Instapundit, and this from (Colonel (ret) Kurt Schlichter):
So why would a commander not order troops who have qualified on their M9 pistols to draw sidearms and ammo and carry them during their duties, at least until this crisis passes? Perhaps their discretion has been withdrawn from higher command – that’s possible, especially with this toxic administration. But more likely it’s because of fear.
It’s the fear that some solider is going to have an “incident” carrying a weapon, and that that incident is going to lead to questions, and in an environment where the Armed Forces are shrinking, the mention of an incident on an officer’s annual evaluation report can mean the difference between a career and a pink slip. It’s the same zero defects mentality that is keeping our military leadership from being an audacious, aggressive band of warriors and morphing it instead into a timid, passive pack of timeservers.
Yeah, troops do dumb things sometimes. During my 27 years leading soldiers, I was consistently amazed by their creativity both in solving problems and in getting into trouble. But while real issues are rare – negligent discharges, lost weapons – they do happen. I dealt with them myself. But that risk is the price of doing business, and when our men and women are being shot down in the street without even a chance to defend themselves, it’s not too high a price to pay.
You train your troops and then you trust them. You punish the knucklehead who screwed up and then you drive on. You don’t turn everyone in uniform into a sitting duck because you don’t want to have to explain to the two-star why Private Snuffy misplaced his Beretta.
Modern America would have lost WW II.
Whenever you hear some general or admiral say something PC, just remember that virtually no one gets promoted to those ranks without being highly political and thus politically correct.
And the notion that this has anything to do with Posse Comitatus is ridiculous. They aren’t going to be carrying automatic weapons.
I’m uncertain of your linkage of Posse Comitatus with automatic weapons. Posse Comitatus, a law enacted in 1878, restricts using military personnel for civilian law enforcement. In the case of allowing military personnel to carry weapons for self-defense (especially in public locations such as recruiting centers that have unrestricted access and are hard to defend), they aren’t arresting or detaining people. The goal is to give them a chance to defend themselves.
I’m uncertain of your linkage of Posse Comitatus with automatic weapons.
Because that’s what would be required for armed servicemen to be a serious threat to a civilian population.
Not necessarily. Are you familiar with Claymores? There are a lot of non-automatic weapons in the inventory that could pose a serious threat to the civilian population.
There is a difference between going armed in a defensive fashion and enforcing civilian law Larry. Yes, the post commander in the clip did a good job explaining it.
Armed military personnel are no more enforcing the law than a civilian with a concealed carry permit is.
And when we transported weapons, we did so under arms on the Interstate.
I was armed with a M1911A1 on my hip, to defend myself and those weapons from theft.
When I was in infantry AIT back in 1975, Fort Polk received a tip from the FBI that some extremist group was planning on hitting the base to steal weapons. In addition to fire guard duty, we were tapped to pull shifts helping the DIs guard the company armory. We were given baseball bats and the DIs had .45s. All of our DIs except one had served multiple combat tours in Vietnam. They were not men who scared easily. However, when asked what they’d do if some group tried to hit our armory, one said, “Me with a .45 against a group of armed men? First thing, I’d hand them my pistol. Then I’d send one of you to wake 2nd platoon to help them load the truck.”
Back in 1984, James Garner starred in a movie called Tank. Here’s an excerpt that explains Posse Comitatus quite well. Good for a chuckle.
I think it’s odd that people EVER question the loyalty of Southerners with regard to support of the government. Especially where the military is concerned.
If you look at the numbers from a per capita stand point, those of us from the South are THE largest group who join the military.
http://www.ijreview.com/2014/07/158892-military-pride-states-boast-highest-enlistment-rates-america/
Look at that map well, it tells much more than who joins the military. It also tells you who and how many take the oath to defend and preserve the nation, instead of trying to make it a quasi Socialist Mini-Europe!
The Obama administration is against letting our troops carry sidearms, but when it comes to Mexican drug cartels, those they give automatic weapons by the truckload.
And when the Moslem Brotherhood took over Egypt, he gave them F16 jet fighters and M1A2 Abrams tanks.
“Modern America would have lost WW II.”
Lost, hell. Modern America (i.e., Bambi and the DemoncRats) would have given it away.
And apologized to Japan for being in the way of their bombs at Pearl Harbor.
IIRC, Chris Garrib supported the position of having the troops unarmed. I wonder if he still thinks that.
*Gerrib
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…Perhaps their discretion has been withdrawn from higher command – that’s possible, especially with this toxic administration. But more likely it’s because of fear….
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Uh, it was a presidential order, from the desk of William Jefferson Clinton.
No, it was George Herbert Walker Bush. It happened in 1992.